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Suggestion New Section of Forums?

Discussion in Website Feedback & Bugs started by Anathema, Mar 11, 2012

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  1. Feb 18, 2011
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    Every once and a while we have a controversial topic where it almost always ends up in a lock. I understand flame wars almost always occur with this as well. My point? Well make a section along the lines of "Controversial Topics" or "Debate" or maybe even "Voting Topics" where users can respectfully argue the points of their topic and side.

    Doing this will not end the flame wars, which is why you can create some rules along the lines of "respect everybody's opinion" or "don't post if all you have to say are things like wrong, racist, stupid, moron, etc." Alongside this you can set up punishments to back the rule up. Just to name a few:
    -Disabled posting.
    -Blocked from posting in the section.
    -Warning level raised.


    Now the mods could be thinking: Why should I spend my time moderating a possibly high-maintenance section?
    All of the following I have brainstormed could be perceived as not doing much but it could add up:
    -Lets people use the rating system a lot more without abusing it so they can easily express their opinion on it if they don't feel like posting or if they agree with another.
    -Gives a sort of release for people who could just attack someones opinion on the forums, so instead he could respectfully point out the flaws in belief someone has.
    -Even individual players can click the report post button so the mods don't have to look at it one by one before judging it as offensive.
    -For the LSA+ if you look at this section you can see if an admin is a downright idiot for posting something without backing it up, or has some sort of intelligence. Why is this relative? It can help you determine a promotion request and weed out people like trolls or people with important biases (I mean like racists, sexists, even pedos.)
    -Allows a way to vent opinions the right way rather than saying something like "fuck you idiot" in a thread. I am sure there are other people in the community who know what I mean as well as agree.
    -Lastly, it can contain most of the troll threads we see now to a secluded section where it would be easy to point out.

    Are there cons to this as well? Yes, I will name a few even though it can hurt the possibility of this actually happening:
    -Mods might have to pay more attention to the section and determine appropriate, inappropriate, trolling, disrespect, and the lot. (But I would be happy to do whatever to make this easier i.e. the wrong posts to the LSA+ so it can be handled with)
    A second alternative to this I am not sure if it is possible but elect someone that has permissions to that specific section to handle the right and wrong posts.
    -More trolling/flaming.
    -Might cause certain community members to not like each other.
    -Could make it harder for mods to pay attention to other threads/sections.


    Open to criticism and even denial, but don't please expel this from your brain just because I said you can.
    • Like Like x 1
    • Jan 12, 2011
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      Interesting, but unnecessary I think. There are occasional controversial/troll threads, but there aren't enough on a regular basis to really warrant a subforum for it. Most that come up can be handled on an individual basis and usually don't require more than a reminder to stay on topic or it'll get cleaned/locked. Not to discourage discussion of various topics, but on the other hand there's little reason why someone couldn't just make a thread for a given topic anyway, provided they put some effort into keeping it a respectful discussion.

      I understand the intent, but I don't think we need it.
      • Agree Agree x 2
      • Jan 8, 2012
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        We have a TF2 and a dear diary subforum, neither which are used on a daily basis. So frequent use I think can stay out of the question. But even if their was a subforum for that, arguments are not usually created on threads, they usually popup inside a thread already created. Maybe it would help direct the flow of debate convos to another subforum? But other than that I don't see a need for one.
      • Feb 12, 2012
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        I have seen other forums with this board, and it ends up in utmost disaster.

        It begins with positive thoughts like this, but the flames with eventually travel outside of the forum. It'll carry over in-game or other boards. Attitudes form, biased views form, and it's just a big mess.



        To shorten it in, it'll be a shitstorm. And I personally don't like shitstorms.
      • Feb 18, 2011
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        One of the reasons why we someone might want it is because the threads that are worth talking about get ruined by one or two morons who post the utmost retarded things just to get it locked. I understand why it gets locked but if we have a section for that there wont have to be as many locks when a fight sparks. A perfect example would be the Kony 2012 thread, I would have loved to see the conversation go on about how people agree/disagree on it, but it took one or two people to make stupid posts that caused it to get locked. Now if I were to create another thread on Invisible Children and Kony 2012 it will either get locked right away or it will get locked after some guy decides to mess up the thread.

        The amount of threads should not matter either because of how one thread can last a long time. Nvidia vs. AMD is a topic that will go on for years just like Mac vs. PC or BF vs. CoD. I recall an AMD vs. Nvidia thread on the old forums that was ooooolllllldddddd but people still posted. Stuff like that can't really be necroed since it is an ongoing debate.

        Dear Diary was replaced by Blog. TF2 is there because we used to have a server. Sure reading another thread could spark a debate, which is why the person would either make a post about it in the debate section rather than deviating from the OP by being a contrarian.

        We are not other forums though, you can't assume we will lose track of it and let it blow up. Rules can be established making it hard for people to say "you are a fucking idiot for thinking that on this thread" while they shoot zombies.
      • Apr 2, 2011
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        Honestly, while I find that Controversial issues that pop up are far and few inbetween... but at the same time... I can't help but find myself in support of this idea. I do believe that the gains outweigh the losses.
      • Dec 6, 2011
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        I support it, other replies were tl:dr most, but I don't know why this couldn't be considered. I think it's an excellent idea to have this as a forum section.
      • Feb 12, 2012
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        Let me rephrase that:

        Several ESTABLISHED, BIG, and HARD-RULED forums have had this issue.


        People can't contain themselves. We have lots of people in the community, and handing out bans/warning for breaking the "Debate" section rules is pointless. We have good server admins and staff here, and seeing someone leave because they couldn't agree with the majority will happen. Biased statements and outcomes will follow after when it comes to Admin Abuse reports or Admin Level-Ups, just because of differences. If you want to think of PF as a utopia and we'll all maintain our bearing, then I'm sorry to tell you you're wrong.
      • Jul 28, 2011
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        This is our chance to prove we can have nice things! I say it's worth a shot.
      • Jun 4, 2006
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        This has been disproven in the past 100 times over.
      • Feb 18, 2011
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        I understand fully but how many times do you think it will happen? The theoretical probability of this is surely there, but in logic if it does happen it will be rare. Look at the ones now, we see them get out of hand and we lock them. So far in my year of being here I have not seen any person bring the debate out of the thread with the exception of 3DG who would actually engage me in a conversation in steam chat rather than saying something rude. The conversations can actually cause the opposite of what you said about they leading into the servers, it might instead bring people to talk in the forums rather than bringing it up in game. Admins have quit but not because of a debates, so far from seeing others they have left because their voice was being left out of the picture. In the section of debate, everyone will have a voice, but at the same time there will be boundaries.

        You said yourself that making boundaries is pointless, but it can keep the things like abuse threads from coming in mainly because you should respect someones opinion.
        I understand pF is not the perfect community, I have yet to meet one. But
      • May 27, 2008
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        Still do.

        This isn't going to happen. If anything, use Dear Diary. There, you can post whatever you feel like and discuss it.
      • Jul 28, 2011
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        Ha I guess you're right... :crying:
      • Feb 18, 2011
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        Replaced by blogs, where things like comments are limited to about 2000 characters which wont really satisfy most people in a debate.
      • May 27, 2008
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        It just seems like you're creating an unnecessary workload for a lot of people. Plus, this could unintentionally cause unneeded drama. In fact, I'm almost certain it will. This will not be something I will be supporting.
        • Agree Agree x 1
        • Feb 18, 2011
          Posts
          I understand the workload portion, but not the unneeded drama. The only way I could see drama happening is if someone posts something just to troll, which can be dealt with. Even if this doesn't happen there should be a change to what is done when a controversial thread comes up. I agree that it WILL stop the troll posts and fights, but all it does is build more tension between people. Like if I said my opinion is right and everyone else's is wrong as a last post only makes people more upset. Assuming things gives you a chance of being right, but it doesn't mean it will happen. I believe it might do the unexpected, and I am sure others think so too. Doesn't mean we are right but its a possibility to consider.

          I don't want to make it look like I am calling you out for not supporting, you can believe what you feel like you should believe. I was just wondering if there is anything a little more specific that bothers you about this?
        • Jul 1, 2010
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          I'm also against this. Not only will it create more work for the LSA+'s, but it will create more drama. And yes, it will. Something like this always does, and I don't see a valid argument that would assure me that it wouldn't. This is not needed.
        • Jan 12, 2011
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          I'm not exactly opposed to that subforum being created, but I'm hesitant if only because it might concentrate people's opinions, as per the idea, but it may become too passionate and people may begin holding biases against others they believe to be either idiots or insulting clots for misunderstanding the purpose of it. I agree with you in that I would like to see certain topics go on in a respectful and contributing manner, and any threads that get out of hand could be cleaned of the shitposts, but I still think it's ultimately unnecessary.

          I'm not as worried about storms coming out of it as some other people, just because it would be handled similarly to existing threads, but I would be mildly concerned about more threads popping up as people may not understand the intent and just assume they can post what they like without much restraint or careful construction/consideration of threads. Again, I do not discourage this, but it's just not needed.

          Edit: I don't mean to assume the possible outcome of the subforum or its contained threads, but there's no reason why someone can't just post a thread in another subforum if it's relevant to the area. Anything that doesn't have an area can just go in "Everything and Anything."
        • Jul 14, 2010
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          This is a gaming community, not a debate forum. :thumbsdown:
          • Agree Agree x 2
          • Feb 18, 2011
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            Going to play devils advocate, do you think we should expel everything not pertaining to our servers? You could easily say that we aren't a tutorial forum, we aren't a creativity forum, nor a tech support, media, hardware and software or mapping. (I'm sure you get the point...)

            I agree with you, but if this were to not happen then there should be at least something done about current debate threads. For example, (using this only because it was one of the most recent) the Kony 2012 thread was a debate and ended with a comment pointing out how people think throwing resources at a problem is the answer. The jist of this is asking the LSA+ to reconsider what is flaming. (I am not saying the current system is wrong, but I am not saying it is right.) I mean this in the least offensive way so please don't take it that way.
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