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Not Abuse Typical Admin Abuse

Discussion in Admin Abuse started by Justin Restivo, Jan 3, 2018

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  1. Jan 3, 2018
    Posts
    [AF] Kalantal

    Banned from the ZM server on Source. I made fun of someone who said "nig*a" and repeated what he said in a mocking tone -- I was told not to say the n-word, which is funny because the guy who said it in a derogatorily wasn't even mentioned. Lack of awareness on the mods part, okay, moving on from that...

    In the next map, users were talking casually about fu*king paraplegics, bigorty, sexism, etc; and I linked this video laughing at the current moderator on the servers illogical stance on racism as opposed to everything else:

    [AF] Kalantal:

    Promptly banned without a word. I guess whoever it was didn't like the reference to their selective and weak attempt at moderating the server? Who knows. Thought you should know about the abuse.

    Mods that were in the server at the time: (Admin) [pF] Haha, owls can't die bro & (Admin) Aphilion.

    Chat log:
    [AF] Kalantal connected.
    Compact freed 1069056 bytes
    Edge connected.
    Aphilion connected.
    Redownloading all lightmaps
    greenmeaniez connected.
    KittehNinja connected.
    Grindtooth connected.
    mits connected.
    Rico connected.
    Bapple connected.
    Arden connected.
    Fry-Delivery Boy connected.
    Punisher023(RST) connected.
    -=๖CŽﮔ=- Bahêa connected.
    Juicy Juicy! connected.
    Shad0w connected.
    Lackyj #CookiesnCream connected.
    LC™ connected.
    Tango connected.
    Mommylover94 connected.
    WhatDoYouEvenThink connected.
    Disk 46 connected.
    JAY connected.
    Roasted Rabbit connected.
    BennyBananza connected.
    zh connected.
    【Canadian Moose】© connected.
    The O connected.
    not seductive connected.
    toodrunktoopley connected.
    leonardo_hatano connected.
    mike connected.
    WeltBay connected.
    Old Man Jenkins connected.
    Scoring will not start until both teams have players
    Voookz connected.
    [pF] Haha, owls can't die bro. connected.
    Pirigo connected.
    -KuLaS-™ connected.
    jazze connected.
    QC_XmX_Zdx connected.
    -90's Mentality- connected.
    Stetki connected.
    [ZR] For help on Zombie:Reloaded commands, type "!zmenu" in chat.
    ¿que te importa? connected.
    ◆HAZY connected.
    VIGILANT-Rest In Peace Lahey connected.
    Kalafs connected.
    Witty connected.
    Твой лучший Друг^ connected.
    iHateMyLife connected.
    [ΖмBя.™] ReNaN Muller connected.
    neer connected.
    FESTIVE PANCAKE™ connected.
    [ZR] For help on Zombie:Reloaded commands, type "!zmenu" in chat.
    [ZR] The game is Humans vs. Zombies, the goal for zombies is to infect all humans by knifing them.
    Nitrota connected.
    not seductive: nominate
    [Source Mod] not seductive has nominated zm_crazycity_pf2.
    [Source Mod] You can rock the vote!
    Punisher023(RST): !pfly not
    iHateMyLife: rtv
    [Source Mod] iHateMyLife wants to rock the vote. (1 votes, 35 required)
    devils son connected.
    【Canadian Moose】© killed Arden with zombie_claws_of_death.
    leonardo_hatano killed Mommylover94 with zombie_claws_of_death.
    VIGILANT-Rest In Peace Lahey killed Rico with zombie_claws_of_death.
    Admin & Donator subscriptions keep this server alive! Sign up at PlagueFest.com and receive in-game perks.
    Tango killed Твой лучший Друг^ with zombie_claws_of_death.
    Tango killed zh with zombie_claws_of_death.
    [Goomba] Tango: Goomba Stomped zh.
    greenmeaniez killed JAY with zombie_claws_of_death.
    Твой лучший Друг^ killed SHAKA_ZULU with zombie_claws_of_death.
    Rico killed ¿que te importa? with zombie_claws_of_death.
    Tango killed [AF] Kalantal with zombie_claws_of_death.
    [ZR] You have been infected! Go pass it on to as many other players as you can.
    【Canadian Moose】© killed [pF] Camo4x4s with zombie_claws_of_death.
    VIGILANT-Rest In Peace Lahey killed [ΖмBя.™] ReNaN Muller with zombie_claws_of_death.
    [pF] Camo4x4s killed Fry-Delivery Boy with zombie_claws_of_death.
    greenmeaniez: !ztele
    [ΖмBя.™] ReNaN Muller: no
    Rico killed Stetki with zombie_claws_of_death.
    Lackyj #CookiesnCream killed Disk 46 with mp5navy.
    JAY: !ztele
    [AF] Kalantal killed QC_XmX_Zdx with zombie_claws_of_death.
    Твой лучший Друг^ killed Old Man Jenkins with zombie_claws_of_death.
    *Spec* [pF] Haha, owls can't die bro.: Stop with the sexism.
    KittehNinja: XD
    LC™: lol owl dont worry about it
    sean connected.
    LC™: i can handle myself
    WeltBay killed leonardo_hatano with m4a1.
    LC™: ask aphillion
    not seductive: !beacon seduc
    [Source Mod] not seductive: toggled beacon on not seductive.
    holychild666 killed 【Canadian Moose】© with p90.
    Tango: OHHHHHH YEA THIS IS SO MUCH BETTER FUCKING QUEERS
    Player statistics are available. Common commands are:
    rank, top, next, statsme or rankcmds for more.
    *Spec* [pF] Haha, owls can't die bro.: I'm aware. Not trying to white knight, just fucking tired of these gits past 2 hours.
    neer: ͡°͜ʖ͡°
    Aphilion: lol
    neer: ͡°͜ʖ͡°
    WeltBay killed Arden with m4a1.
    SirRogers: oooooooooo
    Disk 46: !ztele
    [AF] Kalantal:
    via https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOBoKxEcVAA

    [AF] Kalantal: your logic on racism
    greenmeaniez killed Lackyj #CookiesnCream with zombie_claws_of_death.
    [Goomba] greenmeaniez: Goomba Stomped Lackyj #CookiesnCream.
    Old Man Jenkins: are you a streamer?
    Punisher023(RST): !stopsound
    Disconnect: You have been banned by this server, check http://www.PlagueFest.com for more info.
    Kalantal, Jan 3, 2018 Last edited by Justin Restivo, Jan 3, 2018
  2. Apr 26, 2015
    Posts
    @Aphilion

    @Justin Restivo Can you provide us with any proof such as screenshots, demos, or console logs? It is the players responsibility to come forward with proof for admin abuse as per our rules

    1) The name(s) and/or steam ID(s) of the offender(s)
    2) A brief description of the incident
    3) ALL claims of hacking or admin abuse MUST include some form of proof. ALL UNSUBSTANTIATED CLAIMS WILL BE LOCKED OR DELETED IMMEDIATELY.
  3. Jan 3, 2018
    Posts
    I have provided all the information I have. The admins could be either of the two listed; because nothing was said to me, I have no way of knowing or screenshots to provide. The console log of the only typing I had is in the first post.
  4. Dec 17, 2007
    Posts
    He was warned for saying racial slurs over the mic, but that ended with a warning. However he kept posting websites in chat going to some you tube channel. Was warned the first time and did it again, banned him for advertising websites on the server. He can come back in a day.
    Aphilion, Jan 3, 2018 Last edited by Aphilion, Jan 3, 2018
  5. Jan 3, 2018
    Posts
    @Aphilion You confused me with someone else. I literally mocked someone for being racist and you ignored that person to warn me. That's the only communication I received from you. You said I was linking "websites", which again, just isn't true. I linked a YouTube video two times. Linking a comically relevant video isn't against the rules -- and if somehow it was, you should have said something. There's no messages from you in the console because you got trigger happy and felt like I was making fun of you. That's not an appropriate way to manage a server. If that's really how you remember the event of me linking two videos -- you should probably take a nap or something.
  6. Dec 17, 2007
    Posts
    Posting websites is not allowed on the server.

    I warned you via admin chat which is the proper procedure for this server

    Not going to help your case unless you have some actual proof

    Again not going to help your case by talking shit in an abuse thread.

    Screen shots of You posting the first website in chat, me warning you, and the second time you did it.
    https://imgur.com/a/pnhCA So as you can see, you were warned and the banned for posting websites on the server and your claims of I didn't communicate with you is totally false. We try to encourage fair game play on the server, however trolling will get you no where.
  7. Jan 3, 2018
    Posts
    The proof that you just sent validated my statements of your inattentiveness of moderating the server. You scrolled up to find the linking of the two videos but missed your defense that you warned me. I can't screenshot something that didn't happen, hiding behind that statement is the epitome of a logical fallacy. Your comment below my first link is clearly not addressed to me and is unrelated to what I posted. I didn't realize that posting links was against the rules -- it's not listed in http://plaguefest.com/rules/global . If I had known that was a rule, I wouldn't have -- but again, that has nothing to do with your clear abuse.

    Edit: also, it's lost on me that you have missed the irony of the video I posted: harping on a link being posted and not worried about people talking about raping paraplegics. Classic.
  8. Dec 17, 2007
    Posts
    It's in the second screen shot. You were warned for it bc i was lenient, following proper procedures in escalation with our rules, I could've straight banned you for it. Idk what you've been smoking, but your attempts to troll is going no where. You were banned for posting websites on the server plain and simple, not to mention I doubt you even checked our server rules while you were in the server or even before you make this thread. Try again dude it's all in the screen shots that i've provided.
  9. Jan 3, 2018
    Posts
    You have still managed to skate around actually responding to me for the third time.

    The first and third screenshots were the only two that had been displayed the last two times I went to imgur. I must have missed that in-game when it was said. Hiding behind calling me a troll and spouting off things that are not true is not becoming of an admin. Your 'proof' validates what I said. I'd also love to see a link to the rule that forbids it; you stating doubt of when I checked the rules does not invalidate the reality of the rules. That's yet another weak attempt at defending yourself from obvious abuse. The screenshots you linked shows two things: me missing a warning about linking a YouTube video -- and you abusing admin rights.

    Also see: Illusory superiority
  10. Dec 17, 2007
    Posts
    Well that funny bc every time I click on the link it shows all three screen shots. Kind of convenient that you can only see the first and third screen shot and the one screen shot that has the warning on it you can't see. However, going by our rules and escalation, I don't actually have to give you a warning for posting websites on the server, something you need to get through your head. I gave you a warning simply bc I was being lenient.
  11. Apr 26, 2015
    Posts
    To address the "You ignored that person to warn me" for the racial slur: From the limited chat logs I can see, Aphilion had warned someone at 5:37PM my time [(Admin) Aphilion: rico no racial slurs and the mic out of your mouth] before your slur at 5:41PM which you were then warned for [(Admin) Aphilion: kalantal no racial slurs]. Was this the same person who said it who you were mocking? Possibly, I have no way of knowing with out a demo to hear it for myself. From what I can gather about the server around this time from logs and other admins, it was a bit chaotic with mic spammers, racial slurs, etc. So if it wasn't the same guy you were mocking, its possible that the admins missed it because they were dealing with someone else. Also that being said, Person A saying a racial slur and getting a warning for it is not going to always mean that Person B is going to slide with it after a warning is posted. Same with Person C, Person D, Person E, etc. At some point handing out a tailored warning for each player who was present for those incidents isn't viable. This is a separate thing in it self, but I thought I'd clear that up.

    To address the real issue here. Here is the rule in question http://plaguefest.com/rules/global: No Advertising on the server - This includes advertising hacks, websites, other servers, and recruiting for clans. This rule does not explicitly say links, nor is there a direct rule in either Global rules or ZM rules which mentions links. However that being said, links do fall under the No Advertising rule. We encounter players with CSGO gambling websites frequently in their names who come here which we classify as advertising e.g PlayName CSGOroll.com (or whatever). The rule is pretty much in place to prevent people advertising spam like those CSGO gambling sites, advertising hacks or potentially dangerous websites. Over time its kind of gone broader than that to pretty much include any links in chat. This post by Penguin sums up how I feel about the rule: http://plaguefest.com/threads/lighten-up-on-advertising-racism-etc.21913/#post-310912

    To quote it here as well

    Aphilions warning after you posted the video the first time at 6:03PM [(Admin) Aphilion: kalantal don't post websites on the server plz and thx\], and you were warned by Camo4x4s upon the 2nd time at 6:19PM [(Admin) [pF] Camo4x4s: no external links Kalantal] - This warning was either right before, or right after Aphilion had banned you.

    I will for sure say that even though it seems harmless to post a YouTube link to a meme, that I don't want our admins to have to vet through links to make sure its SFW and contains nothing that is against our server rules. Sure, its YouTube, but the video could still contain racial slurs or other things against our rules. For all anyone could have known without clicking the link it could have been a TeleTubbies video or it could be the 10 hour version of that N***A N***A N***A song.

    @Aphilion One thing I do see is that it looks like you were warned > banned, and should have been kicked upon posting the video a 2nd time. If this was a link directing to CS:S hacks I could definitely see jumping to something, but its also just a YouTube video.

    @Kalantal you say that he missed his defence that he warned you, which he did warn you for.

    I can see both sides to this, and Aphilion was enforcing the advertising rule with no links which I have noticed be a common thing other admins warn for. And I do see Kalantals side to this because in the Global and ZM rules it does not say no links, and I can also understand that posting a youtube meme does not feel like advertising. I do think though that the "No link/advertising" thing has a grey area here which could use some clear discussion about because on the one hand we don't allow advertising other websites but if someone posts a meme which they didn't make like that Rick and Morty clip, that's not exactly advertising.

    At the moment I'd like another @Lead Server Admin opinion on this before making a decision.
  12. Dec 17, 2007
    Posts
    You missing a warning is on you, it is your responsibility to pay attention to the chat. And again going by our rules I don't actually have to give you a warning for posting websites. All these posts that you are coming up with is only showing that you are in the wrong for what you did.
    I don't have to defend myself, it is up to you to provide the proof of abuse not me. Me providing the screen shots, is just me showing what I did where I warned and banned you for posting web sites on the server.
    Post Merged, Jan 3, 2018
    I typically would've kicked for something like this, however I do believe that he was attempting to troll by posting them. It shows it in the first screen shot that I provided, where he stated that the link was for explaining racism on this server. This player and several others were trolling bc of ppl saying racial slurs and how we were wrong for doing it.

    Granted there were a couple of other newer admins on that were being a little too harsh with the rules especially with mic spamming and I had to tell the to calm down a little with it. However with all the chaos going on in the server this player wasn't helping out any by repeating racial slurs that were said and posting you tube links to "explain" the servers thoughts on racism.
  13. Jan 3, 2018
    Posts
    You do have to defend yourself; this thread is about admin abuse, not about my temp-ban. I missed a single line of text with you asking me not to post links. Amidst a sea of people talking about raping and bigotry, you singled out me for calling out the hypocrisy and spirit of the rules.

    @Kyro I must say, I appreciate your in-depth care and attentiveness to this trivial matter. Regardless of outcome of this thread, I did also want to say that my YouTube link did not have malice intent, although I can see why you would want to avoid general links being posted. Noted. I do not agree with a ban being handed out after a single line of text as a warning to an ambiguous rule, but that's neither here nor there. At this point, I feel like the link has very little to do with this tread; I'm more interested in why it's singled out while we have users spamming and harassing the server with exponentially worse content that is being ignored. I wanted what's best for the server, which is why I was even linking to that video in the first place. My goal from the first time I said anything on the server has been to actually see moderation take place. The irony of this isn't lost on me.
  14. Dec 17, 2007
    Posts
    It is up to you to provide proof, if you had read the instructions for creating an abuse thread you would've known that. But you're using ignorance is not an excuse, this thread may be about admin abuse but that is only your claim and not actual fact, bc for one you have not provided any shred of proof that I abused my admin other than providing your own opinion, which is not valid evidence to begin with.

    Funny how you claim I singled you out, it being I banned three other players besides you for similar rules violations. You trying to play the innocence here is the same as trying to use the ignorance card it's not going to work. As for you missing a single line of text, that's on you, i'm not going to give out warning after warning after warning, especially when the sever is being chaotic like that, the reason we warn in admin chat is to get the players attention, if you missed it, then it's on you not me.

    I highly doubt that, if you did you wouldn't have been saying racial slurs over the mic, plain and simple. If there are rules violations occurring, then let the admins handle it, you don't need to get involved. The server admins are fully capable of handling the situation themselves and following proper escalation. I think you're just trying to play the innocent person in attempt to gain sympathy.
  15. Apr 26, 2015
    Posts
    Here's pretty much what I've gathered from all of this. You were warned for not posting links in chat, and from the looks of it you didn't see the warning. The abuse thread is about your ban for the links, not about what else was going on. Not about what the admins may have missed from other players or what situations that from what I can see they were already dealing with.

    That other subject matter does not constitute an abuse thread. When the server is having a bunch of rule breakers, mic spammers, slurs, links in chat, etc shit is going to slip past admins.

    Sure you didn't post a video that was malicious, we have the no advertising rule to cover links cause vetting through them is pretty much a waste of time for admins. A YT link could either be SFW or NSFW, porn and gore can even slip through YT before its removed or for all we know its just a dude screaming the N word. You're also required to post your own proof of admin abuse, we're not supposed to grab it for you. Thats on you, unfortunately its not on us. I dug into this because I wanted to know what was actually happening.

    I've discussed this with other LSA's and Management and we have amended the rules to include no URLs. Otherwise we're requiring to have admins check every single link that comes up in chat to make sure the content meets our rules which we're not going to have our admins waste their time over.

    @Aphilion the action that you took for the situation with warning him not to post the links was the right call. I don't see any admin abuse here. You were enforcing the rules as required as in our procedures and guidelines.
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
      Kyro, Jan 3, 2018 Last edited by Kyro, Jan 3, 2018
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